Meditation

[The_Wanderer]

A couple of months ago I was meditating while lying in bed (I am very new to meditation) and I fell asleep :( I know it's kinda embarrassing. But any way something very strange( yet totally amazing happened). The only way I can explain it is, I think I woke up at the precise moment that sleep paralysis kicks in. I remember opening my eyes and steering at a clock on a wall in front the bed. I suddenly felt a tingling swirling sensation in my hand and then my eyelids shut. I felt a intense wave of energy rushing through my body and it felt like i was being squeezed( it was not painful at all). Then I felt the energy release me for a moment and tightened again (all this time my heart was racing and I was a bit scarred) . But having a pretty good understanding of sleep paralysis i decided to try to relax and i began to take slow deep breaths, and I realized that with each in breath the energy in my body would tighten and then loosen on the out breath. I could also almost feel the blood flowing into my head. I also felt likeI was soaring through the air. I think it lasted for like a minute or two for the most I got really anxious and kinda forced myself to break out of it. My description might be a bit vague , it was one of the most incredible feelings I have ever had it's really hard to express it in words.

If anyone has experienced anything like this or anything interesting while meditation could you please describe it. :)

[scameter]

Actually, Edgar Allen Poe once spoke of this condition, what he called, and as was the title of his essay on it, "Between Sleep and Wakefulness". He said that it is a half dreamy, have conscious state in which we are capable of consciously experiencing our dream state and to see conscious life through it, rather than only having dreams when unconscious. He said it is one of the best experiences, but is generally both rare and brief. But, seemingly to avoid this state as most people of this religion seem to dislike the dream state, a variety of Zen Buddhism attempted to rectify sleeping during meditation by implementing meditation through combat training and other active techniques such as this.

[The_Wanderer]

Hey Scameter you mentioned
Actually, Edgar Allen Poe once spoke of this condition, what he called, and as was the title of his essay on it, "Between Sleep and Wakefulness".

Would you happen to have a link to this essay online?
thanks

[The_Wanderer]

Thank you Psyche it was an interesting read :)

I have another meditative experience I would like to share.

It happened about about 2 or 3 months ago. I had been reading a bit about qi gong practice and about finding your center (Dantien) and it's mystical "power". I decided to try one of the meditations. Like I said in my first post here i'm really new to meditation so I started this with no expectations what so ever. The meditation consist of this; for males, the left hand is placed over the dantien or core (which is about an inch below the navel) and the right hand is placed over the left hand(For females the hands are switched). So I lay in bed and I placed my hands accordingly and just began breathing slowly focusing on relaxing my body and clearing my mind of all thoughts. I think I was laying there for a little over an hour. I became completely relaxed, so relaxed that I could barely feel my body, If i hadn't remembered placing my hands in the position mentioned I probably would not know where they were. Suddenly I felt this 'energy' (This is the best description i can give) flowing into my right hand. It flow smoothly and formed what felt like a sphere. The 'energy' then flowed out of my hand, and in about a second or so flowed back into my hand forming the sphere once again.This happened about 4 or 5 times. I must say it was a really amazing feeling, I became really excited and i quickly broke free of the trance like state I was in. I got up and I was like "Is this real??". Anyway, about a week or two after that I decided to try it again. And after about nearly two hours It happened again this time The flowing energy was accompanied by sound, a sound of an energy beam charging up( I know it sounds cartoonish :lol: but I am completely serious). I have not tried it since then but it was one of the most amazing experiences I have had. I did some more reading and I came across something on acupuncture points and it says there is an acupuncture in the middle of the palm called the lao gong and one near the dantien called the qihaye ( i may have the names slightly wrong) But perhaps what i was feeling was the energy flowing between these points. Has this happened to anyone? Perhaps someone can give it a try. I asked two of my friends to give it a try but they only laughed and said I was was crazy and it was in my mind :angry: I'm pretty sure this was real.

[Thomas Knierim]

Sleep paralysis and lucid dreaming are different phenomena.

I have experienced sleep paralysis on many occasions, although not lately. It always happened when I was about to fall asleep, which seems to be a bit unusual, because people experience it more commonly when waking up. I wasn't familiar with the phenomenon, so I could not explain it. During the paralysis, which affected every part of my body, I felt the presence of a ghostly being. I should say that I don't believe in ghosts. Never have. It turned out that in Thailand (where people do believe in ghosts), this phenomenon is called "phee um", which means "embracing ghost". According to Thai folklore there is a real ghost in the room playing a trick on you. As I already mentioned, I don't believe in ghosts, not even during sleep paralysis, :lol: so I tried to turn my head around to look for the "presence" which was of course pretty useless, since I could not move my head. I remember that at this point, I became quite amused with the state. It was also very interesting. My ad-hoc conclusion was that my own mind is playing a trick on me (rather than a real ghost) and I started a little competition to see whether I can overcome it. So, I focused on my fingers, on my hand, and tried to move the muscles to stretch my hand. After what seemed like an eternity, I was able to move a single finger. Shortly after that full motor control returned; the whole incident probably took several minutes. The other experiences were similar as they all involved the feeling of a ghostly presence. I came across the topic of sleep paralysis only much later and I found that most cultures attribute it to some form of spirit, witch, or ghost.

I don't think it is connected with meditation practice, since the phenomenon appeared at random without any obvious relation to my meditation schedule.

Cheers, Thomas

[The_Wanderer]

Where i'm from, the idea of sleep paralysis is also attached to a superstitious evil 'being'. Because of this the first time it ever happened to me, I was extremely scarred and began praying (that was a couple years ago). When i finally read about the term "sleep paralysis" I quickly realized how ridiculous our old folklore. I must say sleep paralysis can be a scary experience but once you have a clear understanding of it you can just relax and experience it. One night, late last year or early this year, I experienced sleep paralysis 5 times in the same night. I was extremely tired that night, so tired that if i closed my eyes I would fall asleep in 2 seconds. I could almost feel the exact moment where my body would just switch off and go into sleep paralysis. It was after this night that i properly understood it and I got over the fear of it.

[MidnightSun]

First of all its no shame to fall asleep during meditation.

One of my meditation experiences was seeing obstacles when im in deep trance. Three obstacles surrounding each other. Two blue oens nad one green. I described it somewhere in this forum.

However now I do not meditate, I dont find time for it and its quite boring at the moment.

[scameter]

Yes indeed. Here you are: http://books.eserver.org/fiction/poe/marginalia.html And, the particular article is the third one from the top, entitled "Graham's Magazine, March, 1846" :)

[Trevor]

I also felt likeI was soaring through the air.
If anyone has experienced anything like this or anything interesting while meditation could you please describe it. :)

Well I am a fan of Sylvia Browne, and she mentions on "The Montel William's Show" that when you have sleep paralysis, and you feel a presence in the room, and your scared that what you're experiencing is astral catalepsy or astral travel. This is your astral body returning to your body, that is the presence of someone being in the room, and because you're paralyzed you think it's a ghost or alien.
When I was 15 I read a book about astral travel (not by Sylvia Browne whom I had never even heard of at the time) and decided that I would practice and hopefully do it.
One night after weeks of trying, I was dreaming and during my dream the film stopped, everything went black, but I could hear myself breathing. The next thing I knew the breathing faded, and I was rising out of my body. I flew through my little black and white television and floated for a few seconds. I saw myself on my bed, noticing that I was laying on my stomach, and I remember feeling more free than I've ever felt in my life-which suddenly became very frightening and everything went dark again. I awoke, and rememberd everything. I arose from laying on my stomach, and went to the mirror in the bathroom. My eyes were as large as saucers, but I was happy that I had finally done it. It get's easier with practice. Eventually, you won't remember leaving or reentering your body, but if you dream about flying, especially over mountains, oceans, or past the planets, then most likely you have been astral travelling during the night.

[Michael]

Sometimes it may be the astral body. But I had a very nasty expreince in which I had sleep paralysis and was attacked over threes nights. There are energies around which are not always friendly towards us. Best be cautious.

[the_aphid]

Sleep paralysis is simply part of evolution. It is to protect you from acting out your dreams, as this would be dangerous if you were say...sleeping in a treetop.

There are people out there that will sleepwalk, or that talk in their sleep, however these people are not very common. Making noises and walking around would attract predators and potentially cause hazardous accidents if you were sleeping at the time.

Also, there is evidence that evolutionarily adapted predators, such as dogs/wolves, are far more capable and likely to act out dreams, like moving their legs when dreaming of running for example. This is because as predators, they would not be at risk of attracting 'predators'.

So essentially, if you were on the lower end of the food chain, sleep paralysis would be a very beneficial adaptation.

...maybe it is possible that we are 'leaving our bodies to travel around', but quite frankly I don't believe in such things. I believe in lucid dreams, and that you can have profound experiences when dreaming or meditating, however if ANYTHING, I feel these things are being 'transmitted to us' from the 'collective consciousness', in a manor of speaking.

[Squirrels Gone Wild]

There are people out there that will sleepwalk, or that talk in their sleep, however these people are not very common.

As a child from 10-13 I sleptwalk many times. Some of these I remember, and some I don't, and were retold to me the next day.

I would walk to neighbors houses in my underwear sometimes half a mile and knock on their door and 3AM and sit and talk to them. Then get up and leave and go home back to bed. I did not remember those.

I do remember dreaming that I punched my window out of my bedroom, and I woke up dreading that I did...sure enough I did punch my window clean out and there were no marks on my hand. My dad didn't believe me and thought I was lying about it.

I also remember waking up and going outside via the back door late at night. I remember seeing (hallucinating) a black panther. It then started raining and I walked to the front door. I kinda woke up more and freaked out and started screaming and banging on the door (even thought he back was unlocked still, I was not fully conscious). My dad came and opened the door and I went to bed.

I don't do that stuff anymore, but my wife tells me I talk a lot in my sleep now.

[the_aphid]

As a child from 10-13 I sleptwalk many times. Some of these I remember, and some I don't, and were retold to me the next day.

I would walk to neighbors houses in my underwear sometimes half a mile and knock on their door and 3AM and sit and talk to them. Then get up and leave and go home back to bed. I did not remember those.

I do remember dreaming that I punched my window out of my bedroom, and I woke up dreading that I did...sure enough I did punch my window clean out and there were no marks on my hand. My dad didn't believe me and thought I was lying about it.

I also remember waking up and going outside via the back door late at night. I remember seeing (hallucinating) a black panther. It then started raining and I walked to the front door. I kinda woke up more and freaked out and started screaming and banging on the door (even thought he back was unlocked still, I was not fully conscious). My dad came and opened the door and I went to bed.

I don't do that stuff anymore, but my wife tells me I talk a lot in my sleep now.
Yeah, I suppose that we have been 'out of the jungle' long enough to allow for these adaptations/behaviours to take place without consequence/correction. By rare I really meant not the 'norm'. However I have met a number of people that talk in their sleep, but not many sleepwalkers, that still kinda weirds me out. I can't imagine waking up in a totally different place than where I fell asleep.

I did sleep in a bunk bed when I was younger, and apparently I rolled off the top bunk and landed on the floor and didn't wake up, my brother woke me up and told me to climb back into bed. Then he got in trouble for not telling my mom until the next morning, cause my mom was all concerned that I could've broken my neck or something.

[strider]

I recently went to a retreat. We did 20 minute sits, with a 20 minute walk. we did this for 12 hours over two days.
very good. I highly recommend if you are interested in mediation to stop screwing around find a retreat center and DO IT... I have practiced 30 minutes a day for a while and love it.
I never would have though i could do 6 hours straight, but i did, and i got a taste of something.... sweet, something special, and something very spacious. Something first described about 2500 years ago..
I cannot begin to describe how this was or what it was,
I now sit.. allot on my free time. It is there, windhorse is all around.

good luck.

[Trevor]

Is meditation the only way to practice? I read that Zen buddhists believe that enlightenment can be a sudden occurence that doesn't depend upon meditation. Opinions...(I shudder as I open the floodgates):uhoh:

[strider]

I dont know, I only know what i experienced. By that i know i have tried every method my whole life. I now have a teacher who says the only way to experience the quiet space is to meditate and to be mindful. I thought i understood this concept. Then i sat and walked for 6 hours on saturday, then for six hours sunday.
This was it. I tasted it. Its there. The people teaching this to me have "it" all the time. They talk very little. But they have what the tibeten call "auspicious force" or Field of power. They just really want you to sit and breathe, focus on breathe.

Just before one of the Buddha incarnate is to move on, he called his most faithful student to give him the final transmission of information to help when the teacher passed. The student became very excited and followed the yogi to one of the highest peaks around. When they reached the top it was apparent the teacher was in a final stages, the young bodhisattva asked him " teacher please tell me before you pass" . The teacher then climbed to his feet, turned around picked up his garment, and showed the student his extremely calloused rear end.......
Sit.