Otb Experience

[Moonchild]

hi guys! has any of you has an Out of The Body experience? <_< they say that once you learn it, you'll love doing it again and again, i'm kinda curious about it... :examine: i mean how do they do it? constant meditation maybe?

[sonrisa]

I've only been able to do it once & I don't have a clue how I did it. I was around 14-15 years old & had just crawled into bed. I was looking out the window when I realized that my eyesight was level with the top of the window. So I looked up & saw I was around 4 or 5 in from the ceiling. Then I looked down. When I saw my bod laying in the bed I freaked & the next thing I knew I was back inside my bod. Later on I found out I had an out of body experience & that when you are outside your bod you can travel places & stuff, anyplace you want to go just by thinking about it- or so I read. Well, travel bum that I am, I've deliberately tried to get out of my bod- several times over the years, but it's never worked. Don't know what I did to be able to go outside my bod that one time. :dunno:

[Abstract]

It's happened to me several times, spontaneously. Much like sonrisa, I realize what's happening and snap back. It is bone-jarring when it happens, and until recently scared the crap out of me. Now that I've come to terms with it, I seem to be blocking it, and no amount of attempts bring it back.
Generally it starts out with me half-asleep running over the days events and tomorrow's plans, when I discover I am paralyzed. At this point I hear loud whispers and talking, which I discovered recently is my own mind's voice, but I can hear it outside my head. I realized it when I heard my husband's laugh out of my left ear, but he was asleep on my right. Most of the time I wake right up, but about one in three times I'll pop out above my bed, then panic and snap back.
I wish I could get a handle on it. I've heard it's exhilarating, but I was never much of one to pursue an adrenaline rush. I wish I could let go more.

[jesupocaplypse]

I have had a few out of body experiences, but they mostly all happened in my youth with the aid of a large quantity of home grown Magic Mushrooms...

However I have become quite good at lucid dreaming.

[sonrisa]

were you really outside your bod? <_<

or was it the shrooms? :duh:

that's like folx who go into a sweat lodge, eat some shrooms, & then claim they went on a visionquest :shakehead:

[jesupocaplypse]

What's the difference?
My Perspective was outside my body.

Whether a a substance helps the mind to detach from the vessel or the mind does it on it's own / in an unknown manner , matters not. Either way the journier is outside their body, and the experience is no less an experience.

Why do you shake your head at that type of visonquest? Have you ever done shrooms to be able to know what it is your talking about? What exactly, in your mind, is a visonquest supposed to be?

It's an Inner Journey. Doesn't matter if a substance of the Earth, like mushrooms or peyote is consumed to change one's perspective/awareness in the process. The ancient peoples have done it with and without mushrooms and peyote for thousands of years.

So what's the Matter?

[fu*]

My first experience was similar to Sonrisa. The body was snoring, and I was smiling at the funny sound. Felt like baby coddled, but panicked when couldn't reach partner. Had no idea what had hapenned exactly, so started reading. Found in books methods to repeat. Did methods. First time methods worked, sound and feel like vibrating plastic propeller from left side strong enough to snap me out and check room for ???. WOW.
Kept doing practice, and then happenings, and when imersed in it, would happen often.
I think it is like playing an instrument. Some (very few) Are just naturals at it, and the rest of us have to learn/practice.

Some authors who have been paving the road;

William Buhlman
Robert Bruce
Albert Taylor< Abstract may see some simalities in this book
Robert Monroe

It is not magic. Be prepared to spend the hours.
Alas, found no spiritual enlightenment "there". But in the questioning found/am finding "something" "here"

[sonrisa]

jesu- What's the difference?
My Perspective was outside my body.

--I really was outside my body. Were you? Or were you just trippin? Or were you too strung out to know which?


jesus--Whether a a substance helps the mind to detach from the vessel or the mind does it on it's own / in an unknown manner , matters not. Either way the journier is outside their body, and the experience is no less an experience.

-- I agree it's an experience, but is the journier really outside the bod, or just strung out?


jesu--Why do you shake your head at that type of visonquest?

--is it really a bona fide visionquest?


jesu-- Have you ever done shrooms to be able to know what it is your talking about?

-- & acid, & microdot back in the day.... had some sweeeeeet trips.... :)


jesu-- What exactly, in your mind, is a visionquest supposed to be?

-- a visionquest, to my mind, should have some sort of purpose. But then again, I do a visionquest when I need help with some problem that's been nagging at me. To just drop acid or shrooms than kick back & enjoy the ride wherever it goes.... that's not a visionquest to my mind, that's just partying


jesu--It's an Inner Journey. Doesn't matter if a substance of the Earth, like mushrooms or peyote is consumed to change one's perspective/awareness in the process. The ancient peoples have done it with and without mushrooms and peyote for thousands of years.

So what's the Matter?

--you should be able to go on a visionquest without a little help from your friends. By developing breathing & concentration techniques. Using controlled substances compromises the journey, to my mind. Was a really an honest-to -god visionquest? Or a party brought on by the controlled substances?

[jesupocaplypse]

I repeat: What's the difference?

I and my Perspective are one and the same.

You really were outside your body.... Were you? or did you just imagine it? again what exactly is the difference? and how can either of us prove or explain such an esoteric experience?

'or was I just trippin' Experience is universal. I almost don't believe you...

I've never been strung out. I've only ever used mushrooms and ganja that i've grown my self or helped in the process of growing. I've seen strung out people, and can safely say i've not experienced that. I always retain a complete awareness. and often it expands during. I'd like you to explain how 'just trippin' as you put it, is somehow a lesser experience than any other experience in life. Life is Life. calling one person's exp. lesser/greater than anothers is: Judgemental. and i'm sure your bigger than that now arn't cha?

Do you really even exist? were you really outside your body?

WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE??? One thing I've 'remembered' in my experiences, is that mind does not end at my skull. life is but a dream. Your never out of body nor are you ever in it. I am my body and everything around it. I am the air i breathe and the food i eat and the drugs i consume.

Why does it matter what means of transport one takes? Method doesn't matter it's the arrival at the destination that counts.

You sure do use a lot of "should's" in your argument, kind of rendering them substanceless... and again making you judgemental. Who are you to say what path is to be walked to get to a place that your certainly no authority on. Infinite universe. Infinite ways. Keep the should's and the good bads to yourself, cause your the only one they apply to. there's no such thing as a singular right way.

Same goes for a visionquest. VISION being the key word here. Air and shrooms and peyote, and what not all come from the same source. again, you don't know what a 'bona fide' visionquest is. there's no such thing. That's practically like saying that Your god is the bona fide one, and mine is not. :rolleyes:

what you describe as 'just partying' over solving a problem, could be compared to reading a book 'just' for entertainment, or reading a book to solve a problem. Either way your reading a book.

You overuse the word 'just'

Party? well, you sort of answered yourself for me. "In your mind"

honest to god visionquest. hah ha. again with the shoulds.

I enjoy the ride wherever it goes at all times. Does that make me lesser? seems you think so.

Your quite caught up in your Imagined 'purposes'

The only purpose there is: is Experience. Don't condescend me.

controlled substances.. heh, i Don't believe you when you say you've 'done' any of those.

I did say "Mostly" in regards to mushrooms. I don't eat them any more, but I still occasionally plane-walk as i prefer to call it. On my own using controlled breathing and focus. I learned How, thru mushroom use, and now no longer need them to get the job done. I just don't like to do so very often. gives me a 'clipped wings' feeling afterwards, and this plane starts feeling dull and dreary.

The universe is made of energy and matter.

Imagined.

[sonrisa]

so how high were you when you posted that?

sure you've never been strung out?

[jesupocaplypse]

High on life baby. I've not 'done' anything of that sort in many years. Military life, and now the adventures of raising children by myself has put those days well behind me.

Yes i am sure i have never been strung out. Unless you have a different defination of the term than I do. I relate it to, what i have observed and refer to as 'slug syndrome' when i see folks without any 'drive', energy, or ambition, incapable of reflexive action, and unaware of their surroundings. Generally caused by body taxing substances combined with a lack of nutrients and vitamins, especially vitamin C. A state of being that I completely avoided.

[sahyo]

folks without any 'drive', energy, or ambition, incapable of reflexive action,



not require drive-ambitioning

[sonrisa]

no strung out is when you're higher than a kite, totally wasted. Here's the definition according to dictionary.com:
Addicted to, stupefied by, or debilitated by drug use, as in She was completely strung out when they found her. [Second half of 1900s]

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=string%20out


and by real bonafide honest-to-god visionquests, I meant being able to achieve an altered state of consciousness, another plane, as it were, by mental prowess. As opposed to inducing an artificial, pschotropic state. In other words, when you're walking the path, are you talking to your spirit guides & ancestors? Or is it the shrooms talking? From my humble perspective inducing such a state is cheating. It's more rewarding to get there on your own.

[jesupocaplypse]

Your dictionary definition and your definition differ: you said strung out is when your higher than a kite, totally wasted which is one thing.

Addicted to, stupified or debilitated by a drug use, is quite a lot different.

My definition is equal to the dictionary one. No i have never been strung out.
I've never done any actual drugs. Because i don't consider plants drugs. Everything i've done is god given and straight from the earth.

Ancestors or shrooms... show me some kind of real, difference, if the voices are there, and visions are there, and Messages that are recieved, are true, why does it matter how it was achieved?

It's also more rewarding to build a car yourself, as opposed to just buying one. Doesn't make it any less a car either way.

Well, you can call it cheating if you like. Don't make a lick of difference to me. The experiences, and the lessons learned, the truths remembered, and the memories, are all that really matters any way, and i don't care what path is taken to get there. Point is, shroom use taught me how to do it on my own, since the brain operates through the use of chemicals. States of mind adjust due to chemical changes. adding, taking away. It's a chemical reaction.

Walking around the wall, climbing over the wall, or using a key to unlock the door and walk through the wall, it's still leads to the same place. just a different way of getting there.

imagined cheating.

This entire debate needs to end tho, because it will never go anywhere, since it is fundamentally flawed, we cannot debate a personally unique mental experience or state of mind/being, with out some form of telepathy to actually show. words just don't cut it in this situation

Asheera: not require drive-ambitioning ... for what?

[sahyo]

not require drive-ambitioning


... for what?



was referring:


folks without any 'drive', energy, or ambition, incapable of reflexive action



require drive-ambitioning?
....singingbird?

:)

[jesupocaplypse]

Do you hear many strung out junkies singing like birds?

[sahyo]

cannot singing without drive-ambitioning?

[jesupocaplypse]

drive-ambitioning perhaps wrong choice of words to explain the concept, ' energy' likely would've done on it's own.

Yet still, I think there's a certain amount of energy required to have the 'drive' to sing. :)

[sahyo]

:) ...ok

can clarify using word 'drive'?

[jesupocaplypse]

ahh, the 'drive' for/to ______ the energy for/to ______

there's no smilie for a (shoulder's shrug, palms up, phbbtbbb [lightly closed lip blowing vibro sound, which needs a word for itself too] )

[jesupocaplypse]

Sonrisa: mayhaps this will shed some light and help clarify what i've been trying to explain...

http://66.201.42.16/viewitem.php3?id=208&c...33&kbid=ionsikc (http://66.201.42.16/viewitem.php3?id=208&catid=33&kbid=ionsikc)

[sahyo]

I think that the key point to understand about the psychedelic experience, whether you love it or hate it, is that it dissolves boundaries.


what "boundaries"?


It dissolves cultural programming and replaces it with a much more basic kind of programming that is in the human animal.


"basic kind of programming"?

[sahyo]

ahh, the 'drive' for/to ______ the energy for/to ______



as though desiring-goal?

[jesupocaplypse]

Yes.

[sahyo]

cannot singing without goal?

[jesupocaplypse]

the goal is to sing.

[sahyo]

does oceaning goal for oceaning?

[sahyo]

does moistsunningseedsprouting goal sprouting?

[bito]

the goal is to sing.

awareness of goaling

when singing, no of, only singing; where is 'of'?

:)

[sahyo]

not of :


believing here and there
self seeming me, you
universe dreaming

waking sunshining
sunshining waking loving
universe singing


either

[jesupocaplypse]

drops in the ocean baby.

[sahyo]

drops in the ocean baby.


"in" babe?

[bito]

not of :

:thumbsup:

believing here and there
self seeming me, you
universe dreaming

waking sunshining
sunshining waking loving
universe singing

either

not either

until

[jesupocaplypse]

Originally posted by asheera@Apr 5 2005, 10:12 AM

drops in the ocean baby.


"in" babe?
precisely.

[jesupocaplypse]

Has anyone here heard of Hemi-Sync? Or better yet, been to the Monroe Institute, and attended their Gateway program?

A close friend of mine, Paul Elder, has been there often, and has just released a book about his Out of Body experiences. It's called "Eyes of an Angel"

I'm going to sign up for the program, in the coming winter.