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Ayres
15th October 2004, 02:59 AM
Anti-racist PC agendas and the American Anthropological Association's recent confirmation of the unity of all humans have led to the belief that race is a socio-political invention that promotes racism. An ironic accusation since the denial of the science behind race is what's politically motivated. Forensic anthropologist and professor of anthropology George W. Gill, whose assessments are supported by modern genetics, explains.

Anthropology

"First, I have found that forensic anthropologists attain a high degree of accuracy in determining geographic racial affinities (white, black, American Indian, etc.) by utilizing both new and traditional methods of bone analysis. Many well-conducted studies were reported in the late 1980s and 1990s that test methods objectively for percentage of correct placement. Numerous individual methods involving midfacial measurements, femur traits, and so on are over 80 percent accurate alone, and in combination produce very high levels of accuracy. No forensic anthropologist would make a racial assessment based upon just one of these methods, but in combination they can make very reliable assessments, just as in determining sex or age. In other words, multiple criteria are the key to success in all of these determinations.

"The 'reality of race' therefore depends more on the definition of reality than on the definition of race. If we choose to accept the system of racial taxonomy that physical anthropologists have traditionally established—major races: black, white, etc.—then one can classify human skeletons within it just as well as one can living humans. The bony traits of the nose, mouth, femur, and cranium are just as revealing to a good osteologist as skin color, hair form, nose form, and lips to the perceptive observer of living humanity. I have been able to prove to myself over the years, in actual legal cases, that I am more accurate at assessing race from skeletal remains than from looking at living people standing before me. So those of us in forensic anthropology know that the skeleton reflects race, whether 'real' or not, just as well if not better than superficial soft tissue does. The idea that race is 'only skin deep' is simply not true, as any experienced forensic anthropologist will affirm.

"Morphological characteristics...like skin color, hair form, bone traits, eyes, and lips tend to follow geographic boundaries coinciding often with climatic zones. This is not surprising since the selective forces of climate are probably the primary forces of nature that have shaped human races with regard not only to skin color and hair form but also the underlying bony structures of the nose, cheekbones, etc. (For example, more prominent noses humidify air better.) As far as we know, blood-factor frequencies [used to deny race] are not shaped by these same climatic factors.

"Those who believe that the concept of race is valid do not discredit the notion of clines, however. Yet those with the clinal perspective who believe that races are not real do try to discredit the evidence of skeletal biology. Why this bias from the 'race denial' faction? This bias seems to stem largely from socio-political motivation and not science at all. For the time being at least, the people in 'race denial' are in 'reality denial' as well. Their motivation (a positive one) is that they have come to believe that the race concept is socially dangerous. In other words, they have convinced themselves that race promotes racism. Therefore, they have pushed the politically correct agenda that human races are not biologically real, no matter what the evidence."

(George W. Gill, University of Wyoming)


Genetics

The races of mankind have been fairly well delineated by modern genetic distance plots, with Mongoloids forming a cluster to the left, Caucasoids to the upper right, and Negroids to the lower right. Groups of known mixed origin (Lapps, Saharan Berbers, East Indians) are expectedly in intermediate positions.

http://www.angeltowns.com/members/racialreal/race_genes.jpg

(Cavalli-Sforza, Menozzi and Piazza, The History and Geography of Human Genes)

venom mama
28th November 2004, 08:50 AM
earthling

Thomas Knierim
7th January 2005, 01:32 PM
The idea of race is deceptive. Unfortunately, the topic is politically "loaded" and therefore not many people are willing to approach it in an unbiased manner. What concerns the scientific basis of race, this is a fairly complex issue. Only an educated minority has the capacity to understand and assess the biological facts for themselves. Most other people have to rely on external authorities. This leads to the dilemma that people tend to cite those "scientific findings" which acknowledge their preconceived opinions. However, scientists have -like laymen- varied opinions, which means there are anti-race scientists and there are pro-race scientists. Most scientists of the 19th century were pro-race, whereas most scientists of the present day are anti-race. Today, an overwhelming number of biologists classifies the term "race" as biologically meaningless. The reason for this is not a global change in the political climate, but rather a greater scientific understanding brought about by the advent of genetics and the ensuing new taxonomic methods, phylogenetic trees and cladistics.

In the article cited above, the anthropologist George W. Gill puts forward certain criteria, such as morphological characteristics and bone structure, which he claims differs from one race to another. Actually, no scientist would question that these differences exist. There is a whole array of phenotypical properties that vary quite dramatically between different ethnic groups. Some examples are melanism (which determines skin color), somatotype, and even psychomotor skills, which vary significantly among these groups. These variations have been measured and documented. They are not debated. What is being debated is whether 'race' is a valid biological taxon. I should say, that this question was debated, since the debate is essentially over. Scientists came to the conclusion that 'race' is a biological misnomer.

The smallest taxon in the classical Linnaean system is the subspecies, below the species taxon, and the term 'race' has once been suggested to be plugged into the Linnaean taxonomy as sort of a sub-subspecies. However, genetic evidence for this has failed to materialize. What we observe as race characteristics cannot be pinned down to a set of polymorphisms or altered sequences large and consistent enough to provide such a criterion. There are two reasons for this. First, most of the variance is clinal, which means there are geographical and genetical transitions without clear boundaries. Second, the amount of genetical variance that accounts for race characteristics is relatively small in comparison with the overall amount of variance that accounts for other differences in human beings. If we really want a biological taxon below the subspecies level, human bloodtype would make a better criterion.

Thus the term 'race' has at best a historical meaning in biology. It appeared real to the 19th century people, even to the greatest 19th century biologists, including Darwin, who had no conception of genetics. This may be due to the predominant worldview of the 19th century society. Analogously, the geocentric universe appeared real to the pre-Rennaissance people. Apparently both, the medieval astronomers and the 19th century biologists were deceived by appearances. - What is 'race' then? Is it really a 'socio-political' invention? I think the best explanation for the word 'race' is that it is quasi-exchangeable with 'ethnicity'. Ethnicity includes genetic relation as well as a shared culture and geographical region. It is quite simply a consequence of human migration and adaptation to different environments. This adaptation process has an epigenetic and a cultural dimension. It did not divide human beings far enough to justify the use of a biological taxon.

Cheers, Thomas

sonrisa
7th January 2005, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by Thomas Knierim@Jan 7 2005, 02:32 AM
If we really want a biological taxon below the subspecies level, human bloodtype would make a better criterion.


the Lakota Indians have a saying (& I'm paraphrasing it here)

No matter what the color of our skin, or our national origins, we all bleed red.

venom mama
25th January 2005, 09:42 AM
survival of the fittest







it all comes down to natural selection

NeverMind
26th January 2005, 03:20 AM
" we are one race,
its the human race,
just a different smile
on a different face"
-RX Bandits

We are all the same race. We are all homo sapien sapiens. There are a few minor differences that make white people different from black people. People are stupid.

jesupocaplypse
26th January 2005, 06:05 PM
i disagree. I've met many people who are down right neanderthals.

Me, I'm a homosapiensuperior. ;)

Every species has varients. "races" if you will. The human species has different varients, just like dogs and cats and frogs, and snakes, and all the different types of beings.

NeverMind
27th January 2005, 03:09 AM
Magneto wants to kill us all.
He is a homo superior.
WATCH OUT FOR METAL OBJECTS

Just cuz a person is as dumb as a rock doesn't mean they are neanderthals.

Well humans are all humans so racists need to shut the hell up.

jesupocaplypse
27th January 2005, 09:12 AM
i suppose i should've added a smily to note that i was saying that lightly. Still, there are many people still walking around the planet, that are barely more than homoerectus.

:lol: sorry, but i just cannot say or even type that word without laughing.

different races different species, different colors, different different different. different subtypes with races too even. Everyone's different.

Variety is the spice of life.

Be careful about lumping everyone together so easily, to just say we're all humans and we're all equal is only half right, and a broad generalization. Generalizations are rarely beneficial to anyone.

and No, we are not all equal. Not one bit. We are all unique.

Equality is a dead horse
Equiamity is better

NeverMind
27th January 2005, 01:06 PM
You can't say one person is BETTER than another
any more than you can say one snowflake is a better snowflake than another

Everyone has strengths and weaknesses.

Some people may be dumber than you, but maybe they are stronger than you as well.
Or maybe they know how to KILL A MAN WITH THEIR BARE HANDS

All humans are equal in that all humans have both strengths and weaknesses.
You can't weigh the pros and cons of a human being.

We are all equal in that we are all unique.
We are all equally unique!

sonrisa
27th January 2005, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by jesupocaplypse@Jan 26 2005, 10:12 PM
i suppose i should've added a smily to note that i was saying that lightly. Still, there are many people still walking around the planet, that are barely more than homoerectus.



yeah, & you can see alot of them at the beach! :D

NM, sometimes u r wize byond your yrs! :)

Thomas Knierim
27th January 2005, 08:30 PM
jesupocaplypse: Every species has varients. "races" if you will. The human species has different varients, just like dogs and cats and frogs, and snakes, and all the different types of beings.

That is a common but flawed perception. It is unscientific and socially perilous. As for the reasons: see above.

Cheers, Thomas

NeverMind
28th January 2005, 03:38 AM
sonrisa-
thanks for the encouragement.

Tommy Boy-
could you enlighted me/us on the how jesu's thinking was unscientific?
the social implications are relatively obvious.

jesupocaplypse
28th January 2005, 03:55 AM
I hope no one has thought i was implying any sort of good/bad or better/worse with what i said, because i wasn't.

We have different "Varieties" of hair color, eye color, skin color, bone structure, muscle structure, etc etc.

The most obvious and immediately aparent of these varieties is skin color. Due to evolution. Darker skinned people originated in places where they needed to be tolerant of steady hot sunlight.

There is a difference between African frogs and north american frogs. Is one better or worse than the other? of course not. Ideas of better/worse is purely for how something affects you personally. Otherwise, that's very primitive and ignorant thinking.

And we've all been mingling our blood lines so much that the difference keeps thinning and thinning... We are Becoming equals... Eventually we will all be ... i dunno, grey? Or maybe we'll develop the ability to control our skin pigment. so when we go into hot sun, we'd darken... like those glasses that tint themselves in bright sunlight... that'd be helpful. Especially for a whity like myself who burns so easily

Thomas Knierim
28th January 2005, 01:16 PM
jesupacaplypse: The most obvious and immediately aparent of these varieties is skin color. Due to evolution. Darker skinned people originated in places where they needed to be tolerant of steady hot sunlight.

Actually the opposite is the case. Humans came out of the subtropical areas of Africa and were initially all of dark skin color. Lighter shades have evolved later in populations who migrated northwards as an adaptive response to reduced UV radiation in order to facilitate Vitamin D synthesis in the body. See http://anthro.palomar.edu/adapt/adapt_4.htm for technical details.

Cheers, Thomas

jesupocaplypse
28th January 2005, 04:04 PM
you learn something new every day... :)

NeverMind
30th January 2005, 01:55 PM
I actually sometimes learn multiple things

sonrisa
1st February 2005, 06:53 PM
that's good cuz that's what you should be doing